Favino vs. Selmer tonal pros&cons

djangoisgod

Let me know what you think!

Michael Bauer

Can you be more specific?

AmundLauritzen

Well I own a Favino copy(Dell Arte Jimmy Rosenberg) and a Selmer copy(recently acquired Eimers Antique), and since I got the Selmer copy I play that one exclusively.
I feel that compared to the Selmer copy, the Favino copy lacks complexity in some areas of tone. I am not sure how to explain it properly, but the Selmer copy sounds a lot more authentic and vintage. The Selmer copy gets more bite while the Favino is more gentle.
That's by no means meant as a generalization, as many people have Favinos that bark like crazy, and Selmer copies that can sound almost lifeless(in the worst cases). But every guitar is unique, even the same models. I've read opinions of someone who has two Eimiers Antique that he claims have radically different personalities. YMMV.


I like how the Selmer copy feels in my lap and in my hands. It's not as big and inconvenient as the larger Favino copy. For me, the neck feels better as the distance between frets is smaller so it's more convenient for my hands.

I don't know if you think this answer qualifies for your question since I have only tried copies and not an actual Selmer or Favino, but I hope it helps in some way or another

MichaelHorowitz

If you're talking about copies (like the Dell Arte or Eimers that Amund cited,) then it's hard to make generalizations as often such guitars have little to do with the sound that vintage Favinos and Selmers have. And, to complicate matters, even the originals vary greatly as they were made over many decades by different luthiers using different materials and designs. But generally, what you notice when you compare a typical Selmer with a typical Favino, is that the Selmer has brighter highs and an even, yet complex midrange. Favinos typically are darker, with very rounded highs, an upper midrange nasalness, and more bass.

Hope that helps...

M

djangoisgod

I was looking at getting a JWC favino copy(with selmer pliage), but I was also considering getting a selmer copy instead. I also have a Dell Arte favino and I like the way it feels, I don't mind the 16-3/4 inch lower bout. Any thoughts on JWC favino's vs JWC selmer's? Aside from this does Angelo Debarre or Tchavalo Schmitt ever use a favino?

klaatu

Well, as Michael says, copies often do not accurately reproduce the sound of the originals, which themselves can vary quite a bit. I own a '77 Favino that sounds as good as the best Favinos I've ever played, and I've played others that sounded like crap (probably more due to abuse and bad repairs over the years than the original build quality).

Just because a guitar is built to Favino dimensions doesn't mean that it is going to sound anything like the original; same for Selmer copies, or Busato, or Di Mauro, or whatever. A lot depends on the builder - some builders' copies sound almost exactly the same, no matter what they are supposedly patterned after; others, like Bob Holo, painstakingly try to capture the sound of the original (although to my knowledge he's never built a Favino model). Favino style guitars from Rodrigo Shopis and AJL are pretty authentic in sound, although they try for a more balanced sound than the originals, which emphasize the bass and midrange. Killy Nonis' Macias style Favino guitar sounded really good in the YouTube video with Fapy Lafertin (but then Fapy could get great sound out of a plastic Maccaferri).

And yes, probably all of the great players have played Favinos at one time or another.

djangoisgod

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N1F8yiE-V20 this guy seems to be getting some great bark out of his JWC favino--- but then again it's a youtube video

Passacaglia

I don't have much experience holding or playing high end guitars (next year's DIJ, Michael - this time, I won't be shy!), but having just received a D-Hole Model F from Rodrigo Shopis, I am absolutely blown away, and please allow a bit of gushing because I think it's germane to the discussion. It's the most beautiful thing I've held in my hands. The guitar is everything I had hoped it would be, after careful consideration and hounding of a number of players (thanks, guys...don't want to out you, but you know who you are), I settled on one by Rodrigo.

I've just gotten it so I know there's years ahead to get to know each other. But my first impressions (and again, I'm no experienced player or collector - just a very simple soul with a pretty simple desire, to play rhythm well): The guitar is rich, incredibly responsive and is, as Ben said, balanced across the range. It has a kind of sensual, luscious darkness to it and indeed the trebles are rounded - but clear as a bell. It plays so sweetly; yet it growls, at command. Even when pushing it, it's never harsh. Exactly what I was looking for, and hoping this guitar would be. It is incredibly playable. Simply a master work, in my opinion, and I'm humbled by Rodrigo's gift.

Anyway, I know this is a thread about Favinos and Selmers, so don't want to veer too much towards honoring this guitar and the man who made it. But if this guitar is reminiscent of the best qualities of Favino guitars, then I bow in respect to Rodrigo, and to the lineage he has learned from and mastered, to make his own voice with these quality instruments. Forget which film it is showing Boulou & Elios Ferré inside M. Favino's shop, obviously at home. And forget which of Michael Dregni's books talks of players just routinely doing the same....but seems the Favino shop is a place very close to a lot of hearts. I understand why.

Paul

Colicab

I can't comment much on the comparison on tone, but I have a JWC Favino D-hole(number 334).
Great guitars! And the service was most excellent. Can't say enough good things about them!

Al Watsky

I think everyone has addressed the OP's question.
One might mention that the Favino Modele 10 is a larger guitar than the Selmer model.
It accounts for some of the difference .
The other differences stem from other physical differences.
Selmers have a blockier neck and in my experience are lighter in weight and generally brighter in tone with less low end.
Many players prefer the feel of the smaller Selmer body but with a slightly slimmer more "modern" neck.
Speaking generally the Model 10 is a more modern instrument and it seems certain that it was developed with much input from the players that used them. I believe that the Favino's were trying to move the game forward and were seeking to evolve the instrument with the Selmer as a starting point.
Favino's vary wildly. They are their own world. Ofter the buyer would ask for a sound that pleased them which accounts for the variation in sound in many cases, that seems true especially with the later guitars.
I've only played 2 Selmers they were both in top condition , both were loud, one was bright and rather shrill good for single lines, the other was more balanced and would be a better all round guitar.
You couldn't identify them as being from the same maker in a blindfold test.
I've played several Model 10 Favino's and a couple of Macias style one the earlier smaller size the other the model 10 style. The model 10's all sounded very similar in a general way , loud , dark trebles and a big low end. All have the same balance point which effects feel. The "Macias" models were apple and orange different. The older a small bodied guitar that seems to reference a Busato style as far as neck profile and size and dryness . A later Macias was very loud very bright , much like a bright Selmer but with the large Model 10 body style and a wetter sound.
So ? Go figure.
Its nice when you commission a guitar or other instrument from a builder and you like it. They do their best and will turn out a guitar that is of high quality and that will function . No telling if its the guitar of your dreams though. Thats really not in their hands.It will most likely be the best guitar you have owned , the highest quality and etc. After all how many guitars or other instruments does the average person commission in a lifetime ? How can they judge the quality objectively ? Most can not.
I've had several instruments built for me over the years. Some were better than others , all functioned well but in the end a guitar is only as good as the player and I find that my favorite guitar is the guitar I'm playing that day.
As it happens the GJ guitar that I own that has paid me back the most in monetary terms is not the best guitar I own by a long shot. It just happens to be the one I've taken to work most often because its just about the cheapest one I own. Its a tool.
There are a bunch of great hand builders out there. They can all build you a guitar that will play well and sound good. Its just a matter of deciding which you want to buy.
The best way to find the best sounding guitar for you is to decide which model you are comfortable with and then play as many of that model as you can get your hands on. Buy as many as you can afford and then learn what it is that you want in a guitar. It takes years. Enjoy the process.