The right gear to reconcile influences....

jazzbum

Hello All -

I thought I might post this here, because this is such an impressive community.

For years I have been sort of collecting guitars and reselling them, looking for THE sound.

At the same time I have been playing semi-professionally. The majority of the gigs I get are actually jazz manouche or musette. Since I first heard Django I have been in love with him.

That said - I am also heavily influenced by modern guitar players - Kurt Rosenwinkel, Tim Miller, Ben Monder, Peter Bernstein etc....even Ornette Coleman.

This has been a great dilemma in finding my own voice. On most gigs it's pompe and a few solos on my Gitane 250, and I go home to an electric semi hollow guitar. The problem is - when I play electric I feel like I am missing something, and when I play the Gitane I feel like my moderate grasp of rest stroke picking is limiting what I can play.

So here is what I am looking for - a guitar that I can pick up and play in either style. Ideally I would rely less on the rest-stroke technique (sacrilege I know, but I'm just being honest). I am not trying to be an "authentic" gypsy jazzer anymore.

In general I think my tonal preference is on the acoustic end. Similar to that of Julian Lage. I am obsessed with dynamics - and electric guitars do not particularly have great dynamic range, at least that you can control with your picking hand.

I would keep the semi hollow ibanez and the Gibson 125 I have for electric gigs (LOUD GIGS), but I'd like a new acoustic possibly with the ability to play plugged in. Pompe and solos are key for practicality, for creativity's sake - it ought to sound just fine without rest stroke technique (short scale maybe).

ANY suggestions, thoughts or opinions will be much appreciated.

swingnation

Try ALD or Hahl guitars. Or just ask Michael Horowitz- he'll steer you right.

MichaelHorowitz

Yes, the Hahl guitars are the ultimate modern Gypsy guitars, allowing for both trad. Gypsy playing as well as more modern jazz styles and even folk if need be. They have the midrange fullness required for non-Gypsy styles.

Generally the D hole models by most luthiers will also boost the mids and give you a lot more stylistic flexibility and are generally much more forgiving of non-Gypsy technique. The Dupont MDC-50and ALD D holes are particularly nice for this.

La Fee also specializes in building "modern" Gypsy guitars, this model is sort of like a budget Hahl, great balanced sound and performance for much less:

http://shoppingcart.djangobooks.com/gui ... che-2.html

good luck!

Michael

jazzbum

Thanks Michael!

EXTREME gear lust for that La Fee, what an axe! Sadly, I'm not sure how I could afford it right now, unless I sell all my other gear.

I hate the idea of stop gap solutions because so many of my instruments could be categorized as such, but considering my financial situation I would have to be pretty much 100% sure this is the guitar for me before buying it.

Perhaps some ideas on the low(er) end to replace the Gitane as a start?

MichaelHorowitz

For a full bodied, rich sounding guitar under $1K this is tough to beat:

http://shoppingcart.djangobooks.com/gui ... el-42.html

The Paris Swing 42 quickly became one of the best selling guitars in this price range....Music Link did a really nice job on it. It sounds very lush and full and the fit and finish is among the best I've seen on an Asian instrument.

SomeDude

We ALL have this problem. I do anyways. My suggestion to you would be to get an acoustic archtop and fit it with a good pickup (Benedetto etc.). That way you can get a good acoustic sound and still play in a traditional western jazz way with alternate picking. If you work on phrasing your lines ala gypsy style then the tone may not be the same but it will sound fine. You can also play modern stuff on a full jazz box, Rosenwinkel and Lund both have. Lastly, as we all definitely know (the hard way), if you can play it doesn't matter what your gear is! Theres no gypsy jazz police, play whatever is comfortable so long as you don't play a solid body...then you're asking for it.

jazzbum

I was thinking about that Paris 42. Looks like a winner. Definitely like the idea of supporting actual Luthiers though. Someday.....

SomeDude -

Thanks. It's good to know I'm not alone. I have spent years trying to figure out how to sound like this guy or that guy and to some extent I can pull off some pretty wicked modern jazz lines/tones out of my electric guitar, and a few Bireli-isms. My technique is pretty solid (at least where I want it to be now), I just need to find the guitar that matches sounds in my head, or is most easy to manipulate to match those sounds. I am certain that I sound pretty much the same - musically - on my J50 as on my Gitane or Semi-hollow.


RE - Solid Bodies -----
Tonight at my gig I'll bring my ESP and pull out my chart for METAL EARTHQUAKE. JK HA.

Jeff Moore

You might take the both ways approach.
A coil and a "natural" pickup, and a switch to get you back and forth and both.
I favor the Gj guitars for the attack.
I have limited experience with great archtops personally, but just listening to recordings, I'll still favor the Gj guitar regardless of whose playing and how they do it. Once you put a coil on a GJ guitar, you can pick your flavor from a thousands types of coil(s), and it isn't necessarily very dependent on the acoustic sound.
Once your wired both ways you may find that rather than "settling down" into your style, you are happiest wandering amongst them.

Steveareno

So GJ guitars with more midrange and a warmer tone are "modern"....those with more bite, high end and bark are considered "traditional"? Interesting. I prefer a warmer, mellow tone and my GJ guitar seems to deliver: a Dell Arte Studio (no frills) Hommage (mahogany body). Got some kinda built-in low gain transducer style pickup which sounds pretty good, if I need to amplify it. It still has the brilliance you'd expect from these things, but more mellow than most. Also settled on a pick that helps round out the tone: Grisman Dawg 1.50 mm (read an interview with Grisman, where he comments on his pick mellowing the highs).
Swang on,