Theory Book

Jim Kaznosky

kevorkazito wrote:

AmundLauritzen wrote:

...What those new to theory want to avoid though, is heavy chord-scale "modal" theory like "The Jazz Theory Book" by Mark Levine. That book is more of a reference. Trying to learn in modes is not beneficial to gypsy jazz unless you're already an advanced player.

Whoa! I'm glad I read this. I was just about to buy that book, now I'll hold off for time being. Thanks!

Don't avoid it altogether. It is still a great book. I use it pretty frequently. I'd suggest getting it if you are interested in looking under the hood a little deeper and want to understand other ways to "name" things or see a different picture.

Jazzaferri

Memorizing them one at a time, just like Django....he however had a fabulous ear and an uncanny ability to sense where the music was going. Witness his playing off the cuff with Ellington and Benny Carter amd other areanged band leaders of the day.

The downside to this approach, is that unless they have a really good ear, your pupil may take a very long time to get it.

Why do you want to not use an approach that has been used successfully for centuries?

kevorkazito

jkaz wrote:

kevorkazito wrote:

AmundLauritzen wrote:

...What those new to theory want to avoid though, is heavy chord-scale "modal" theory like "The Jazz Theory Book" by Mark Levine. That book is more of a reference. Trying to learn in modes is not beneficial to gypsy jazz unless you're already an advanced player.

Whoa! I'm glad I read this. I was just about to buy that book, now I'll hold off for time being. Thanks!

Don't avoid it altogether. It is still a great book. I use it pretty frequently. I'd suggest getting it if you are interested in looking under the hood a little deeper and want to understand other ways to "name" things or see a different picture.

Yes, I am interested in getting in deeper. Have you ever heard of Robert Conti? I just started with his 'The Chord Melody Assembly Line':

http://www.robertconti.com/products/shop#!/~/product/category=451831&id=1610597


This guy is taking me places that I used to think were 'off limits' because of complexity of it. I plan to get the rest of his 'Source Code' series for sure.

I like his tag line: 'No scales, no modes'

AmundLauritzen

jkaz wrote:

kevorkazito wrote:

AmundLauritzen wrote:

...What those new to theory want to avoid though, is heavy chord-scale "modal" theory like "The Jazz Theory Book" by Mark Levine. That book is more of a reference. Trying to learn in modes is not beneficial to gypsy jazz unless you're already an advanced player.

Whoa! I'm glad I read this. I was just about to buy that book, now I'll hold off for time being. Thanks!

Don't avoid it altogether. It is still a great book. I use it pretty frequently. I'd suggest getting it if you are interested in looking under the hood a little deeper and want to understand other ways to "name" things or see a different picture.

Yes, by all means it is a good book. But it is not good to learn practical theory from the ground up for someone wanting to apply that theory to gypsy jazz. Very many students get confused by trying to use the Levine book as a method.

It's a very good reference though, a place to get ideas when you're in a rut or simply to explore new concepts. Though many of the concepts deal with modern jazz. The chords built in the book are voiced like a piano player would, and the book is aimed more towards mainstream jazz/bebop. It is not the place to learn how to sound authentic in gypsy jazz. However, when one can already play the gypsy jazz language I think the Levine book is a great supplement. It can shed light on theoretical concepts that you then can use to analyze what you already know to get new ideas on how to use it.
Or you can get ideas to come up with new stuff.

I remember way back when I started to learn bebop. I bought the Levine book and tried to learn from that. Boy what a headache! Later I took lessons with Jimmy Bruno and he taught me the nuts and bolts of music: chord construction, chord progressions, key signatures and all that. When I had that knowledge in the back of my mind and could play some music, I was able to go back to the Levine book to gather ideas. They made sense in a whole new light to me.

I am by no means trying to discourage anyone from buying the book, just pointing out some ideas on how to use it in a smart way. I don't know the book that Jazzaferri suggested, but judging from the topics presented, it seems to deal more with what someone new to theory should focus on first to grasp the nuts and bolts of music

Jon

A good review of the Levine book for those who may be interested, highlighting it's main flaw - completely ignoring functional harmony and diatonic chord progressions, and how, if used as an explanation/template for how musicians in older styles (like ours) improvised, it is just very confusing, and really not helpful at all.

http://www.mtosmt.org/issues/mto.00.6.1/mto.00.6.1.rawlins.html

Enjoy

Jon

Jazzaferri

In our jazz language course we used parts of it as a reference only.

Our prof disagreed with some of the concepts an with the way some of it was presented.

What we dod use a lot of was the chapter on melodic minor harmony.