Help Wanted: Harmonic Analysis of Transcriptions

richter4208

You should definitely delete that pdf Theo. Christiaan would be not pleased to see that posted here.

I already have the pdf you posted (from when I was a member), I will take a look and answer your questions you inserted in the pdf

richter4208

measure 16 uses the melodic minor a half step up from the dominant. So here the dominant chord is D7 and the lick Stochelo plays is derived from eb melodic minor, a very common descending lick.

Measure 25, yes the dorian mode works nicely over both the ab and a minor chords. I would just remember that for this specific tune you can use that scale or licks derived from that there. It works nicely

The answer to 40 is both. Yes the natural minor notes work nicely here and these notes fit that, but it is also true that those notes fit D7#9b9 which is derived from G harmonic minor. But in this case I will say it sounds like a V to i minor sound, so D7b9 to G minor. Stochelo does this kind of thing constantly on minor tunes. Often hinting are fully playing the Vb9 chord sound even tho it may not happen on the rhythm guitar.

bar 44, Yes definitely Bb major here. No you don't have to ignore the diminished, but yes stochelo does ignore that chord.

45 yes natural minor

47, no he is not thinking Ab, he is thinking Eb7 to D7b9. Eb7 works in this case because stochelo is thinking of a different turnaround that what is actually being played by the rhythm player. As Christiaan points out its a little outside, frankly I think it sounds good. But don't let Denis Chang hear that.

I'll keep going if you find any of this helpful,

My real advise tho is just learn this whole thing as an etude and get it up to speed with a backing or metronome. You'll find magic happens once you get the notes under your fingers. Just judging from your questions you already know enough. Turn off your right brain for a bit and just learn to play these phrases as close to at speed as you can. Then choose the ones you like and use them as much as you can in similar settings on similar changes

GadjoTheo

Wow, Richter 4208! You've saved me weeks-months of struggle, and I'll be studying these notes tonight. I might have a few questions if that's ok.

Your insights about using the piece as an etude make a lot of sense to me. I'd love to keep digging into the theory though, but I'd hate to bug you for line-by-line questions. What do you think is the best way to learn this type harmonic analysis?

Apologies Christiaan for posting the pdf! Immediately deleted.

Buco

Dennis just put out a video out that is pretty much on this topic and you can go get one of his paid lessons if you want to dig deeper. But this video is well worth watching:

https://youtu.be/pDk3JvhYOjE

littlemark

From the midi solo. First question. Ab7 is a substitute for D7. (Flat 5 substitute). Meaning you can play D7 stuff over Ab7 and vice versa). I see the G more as a sus 4 tension that is resolved at the beginning of m.48.

Ab7 = Ab C Eb Gb

D7 = D F# A C the 3rd and 7th of both chords are interchangeable. But think of both chords as wanting to resolve to G maj or G min. I'll show you how they want to resolve.

Ab and Gb to G

C to B or Bb

Eb to D.

Or D ... Stays

F# to G

A to G or Bb

C to B or D.

littlemark

Question 2. M. 67 and 68. Those are just passing chords. Really you can play G minor ideas from m. 65-68. The D7 is optional, tension. (Recommended!)

To answer your question about the F7 and Bb6. He is playing a G minor arp over the F7. He's ignoring the passing chords.

What you should be thinking about in this tune is g minor ( home).. Then tension (away from home) then resolve it back to home. Really that is music in a nut shell.

richter4208

Gadjotheo......feel free to privately send me your questions about any rosenberg academy transcriptions

riker4208@gmail.com

you can email the pdf marked up in red and I'll try to be helpful.

I've learned several of the transcriptions as etudes and found it very valuable for many different reasons. Some of the tunes to start out with are Honeysuckle Rose, Dinah, and maybe something like Sweet Georgia brown. Just as ideas. Minor swing wouldn't be a bad idea either.

littlemark

Question 3. In m.69 he is outlining the Cmin, emphasizing the Eb. C minor and G minor6 share some notes.

C Eb G and G Bb D Eb.

It sounds like you are thinking more in terms of scales. Try thinking in terms of chord tones and embellishments. The C# is a tension to be resolved on D. He's treating the Ab7 as D7 again.

GadjoTheo

https://www.djangobooks.com/forum/discussion/comment/107718#Comment_107718

Thanks, littlemark! I'm wondering what scale he's playing in bar 47 then. It doesn't seem like a D7 scale to me with the Ab...and then the phrase ends with an F, D#, D as it comes into bar 48. Do you know what scale this is?

GadjoTheo

https://www.djangobooks.com/forum/discussion/comment/107723#Comment_107723

Okay! So the C# in bar 70 is more like a blue note. I'm guessing a flat 5 just often sounds good as a passing note for added tension on a minor chord?