Tempos

dennis

i'm giving a workshop on the django style this saturday at jack's place (thanks jack!!), if you can make it, i will be talking about how django and the gypsies approach improvisation (voice leading techniques) among other things.

but about nuages, jack is right, try to thing of Db7 and C7 as V chords...

regarding the ii chords, those are indeed the original changes... in general django and gypsies don't make much distinction between ii and Vs... ii is basically a Vsus4, so if you play around with a Vsus4-V idea, it might be a bit easier on the brain...

but really the best is not to think in theoretical terms but to find ways to link up the chord changes as smoothly as possibly (perhaps even through the use of pedal points, motives, repetition, etc...) hence voice leading...

transcribe the first 8 measures of the second version of nuages django recorded (i think it was 1941) for an example of what i mean, he's not thinking in terms of scales or arpeggios, but he sees shapes of all the chords on his fretboard and tries to connect each shape as smoothly as possible... it ends up sounding like music and not arpeggios or scales or whatnot.... of course, this is a WHOLE lot easier said than done... the concept is very simple but you just have to be creative...

Jack

andy wrote:

Hi jack,

I don't mean to be thick, and neither do I mean to presume upon your generosity in answering these posts, but I'm not quite sure I get it.

Do you mean to treat Db9 and C7b9 both as if they were V's -- in which case I might play a diminished run starting on D and C# respectively, as you suggested to me in a previous thread -- or do you mean to treat the bar in which each chord appears as if it contained a ii-V, thereby playing an Amin idea for two beats (say), that moves to a Db9 idea for the other two beats? See what I mean? Is the ii a theoretical implication or an actual sound?

Andy,

No thickness nor presumption-it seems like Nuages is one of those tunes that often stymie people when they're starting out; it seems simpler than it is (a mark of a great tune, I think). Your ii-V question is neatly answered by Dennis above, but if it helps, you might look at this chart, which lays out those changes: http://www.gadjodrom.com/grille.php3?tune=nuages
Like Dennis wrote, I don't make that much of a distinction between the ii and the V; I just thought you might already have some ideas worked out for other tunes but hadn't noticed that you could think of Nuages that way. By the way, that chart's in G; you'll probably end up hearing people play it in both F and G, so it's worth knowing both ways.

andy wrote:

Do you give lessons, btw?

Currently, no, but if you can make it down this weekend, let me know-it looks to be an all day affair...also, if you're up for travelling to NYC, Stephane Wrembel is both a hell of a player and a great teacher; you can reach him through his website:
http://www.stephanewrembel.com/home/index.html
He's also got a book out through Mel Bay. In the meantime, though, I'm always glad to share what I know.

dennis wrote:

i'm giving a workshop on the django style this saturday at jack's place (thanks jack!!)

Are you kidding? Thank you! See you then-let me know if you need anything in the meantime...

Best,
Jack.

nwilkins

Yeah - part of the confusion might be that the first chart Jack linked to does not include the original harmony - the first two bars do contain ii-Vs BTW could a person theoretically play an F#maj arpeggio over the first bar?

andy

Thanks guys -- that does help a lot. That the gadjodrom chart makes the ii-V change explicit makes it easier for me to think in my rather literal fashion about these things, before (hopefully) going on to try Dennis' less-mechanical and more inventive approach.

I would LOVE to be there this weekend, but unfortunately, it's a little short notice. Is there a list of forthcoming events anywhere?

Cheers everyone,
Andy

Jack

andy wrote:

I would LOVE to be there this weekend, but unfortunately, it's a little short notice. Is there a list of forthcoming events anywhere?

For now I'd say just keep an eye on the US listings here. We're hoping that this weekend will be the first in a regular series of jams, maybe twice monthly, so I'll keep you posted on that. I remember someone out west used to have a website called gyspyjazzjam.com (I don't think it's there anymore) which had a really great premise: it not only advertised where and when a jam was happening, but also included charts and sound files for a slew of tunes so everyone could bone up on the repertoire beforehand. If we get this one happening, I might look into trying something similar here.

Best,
Jack.