Tremolo. Is it necessary for mandolin?

Ted Eschliman

Okay, I'm feeling adventurous, and I'm counting on an open and nurturing crowd. Coming from 30 years of playing guitar, the mandolin seemed an answer to a maiden's prayer when I picked it up eight years ago. I love the open fifths tuning and the glorious sonic potential of this instrument, and being a jazzer at heart decades before, envisioned there is much uncharted terrain for jazz mandolin.

The only "signature" trait of the mandolin I've never come to appreciate is its alleged dependence on tremolo. Not that I can't do it, I just don't like the sound of it. Further, I think it can become a crutch for sustain, rather than depending on good left hand finger control the majority of the time. It's worse to my ears when a row of mandolinists indulge in group tremolo--a bit like geese preparing for flight.

Yes, this is PURELY personal taste. Am I alone in my disdain for tremolo? I know in some circles, I'd be pelted with rocks and garbage for suggesting it.

Jack

Ted Eschliman wrote:

The only "signature" trait of the mandolin I've never come to appreciate is its alleged dependence on tremolo...
Yes, this is PURELY personal taste. Am I alone in my disdain for tremolo? I know in some circles, I'd be pelted with rocks and garbage for suggesting it.

Taste is a funny thing...I love the sound of tremelo on a stringed instrument, but I've had to come to grips with the fact that I really dislike mandolin. Go figure!

Best,
Jack.

MichaelHorowitz

I actually like tremolo too, but I see what you're saying about it's use in jazz. It definitely gets used as a crutch by mando players...

But if there's a jazz genre were tremolo is appropriate, then Gypsy jazz is it. Single note tremolo on guitar is relatively rare in Gypsy jazz, but sometimes is used. Especially by the more folky players like Bousqet and Tchan Tchou. But even Django did it sometimes....

and chordal tremolo is used all the time.

delsbrother

Geez Ted, what are you, the self-hating mandolinist?

OR... Perhaps you're just a Crafty Guitarist.

Cuimean

I know trombone players who think trombone glissandos (glissandi?) sound cheesy. Stuff Smith's bow technique purposefully took away the distinctive legato sounds often associated with the violin. Playing mandolin without tremolo could be an interesting way to come up with a unique sound.

dunbarhamlin

I think tremolo has its place as an occasional ornament.

My tremolo isn't good, since I don't practice it, but as I appreciate neither warbling singers nor endless professionally produced tremelo, I'm confidant that this is a symptom of my disdain rather than a justification of my ineptitude.

I'm trying to build mando things (just for me at the mo) that have a respectable sustain without having to stutter through each note. So far, so good - I'm using Vega influenced 'ridge' backs (but with deep (3") thin back braces which do seem to have positive tonal effect without the damping effect of a Virzi,) along with large neck block (extends to both points) and light weight x-braced induced arch tops (like a normal steel string)
Experiments with canted tops (like a Selmer, taterbug or Vega) and carved tops, all with ridgebacks, are in various stages of development.

Steve

jmcgann

One reason the "woody" bluegrass mandos aren't great for jazz is the lack of sustain. To avoid tremolo, you need a note that doesn't die like a banjo. I love my Zeidler for that reason- tremolo is not mandatory, but a nice effect/spice used on occasion...on the other hand, it's never gonna be a wind instrument without serious modification :twisted:

Ted Eschliman

John, you're telling me you don't moisten your reed before you play?...

Thanks for everybody's input on this. I don't mean to be condescending in regards to truly good players' tremolo, David Grisman and Don Stiernberg come to mind, but they also already have the necessary linear sustain as basis of their overall sound. Certainly, tremolo has its place in dramatic effect, Django used it well for this. (Yodeling is an "effect," too, and there's only so much of that my ears will take.)

Great points about the need for sustain vs. woody chop. I just had Bill Bussmann (Old Wave Mandolins) make me a 4-string mandola (jazz-box), and the goal here was lots of fundamental and sustain. It's there, I only have my playing to blame when it's not produced! Pictures and story here.

Steve, I'm fascinated by your building pursuits; I'll be excited to see what you come up with! I'd never thought of tremolo as "stuttering," but if it's truly bad, this is pretty much the effect on my ears.

djangolin

So Ted, when are you going to post some sound clips for the new Dola? Inquiring ears want to know.

hotclub

Ted, I'm behind you 99% on this. The only exception I can think of right now is for the first note of Anouman. I can't think of a better way to play it, but usually the lack of sustain inherant in short strings can be mitigated by chord melodies or vibrato. I'm behind you 100% on the single string theory. Usually people don't even notice that I only have 4 strings on my mando, they just think I'm playing in tune. I'd love to hear your new mandola. Steve

Peanut

I'm not going to throw any stones, but I think that tremolo's great, if it's not overused. And sometimes, there's nothing better than busting out Santa Lucia...