Going from Gypsy picking to electric technique

ThomasGtar

why not use the legato technique alot thrown in with picking? this way you can keep you gypsy picking technique, you can reduce the amount of picking by a big percentage. I think legato mixed with picking is the solution for crossing over the easiest way. Plus to me it sounds alot more interesting than picking every note. If you want to do bebop, why not use overdrive...........to me this sounds alot more like sax or trumpet than a hollowbody does........ala alan holdsworth.

ThomasGtar

even if you are playing clean on your bendetto................why not use legato with picking? For some reason legato seems to be a shunned technique of hollowbodies with a clean tone. In the bebop style i see guys picking practically every note and throwing in slurs here and there and this seems to be the way everyone's done it. I don't think however legato works welll in gypsy jazz...........just in slurs.

HotTinRoof

Hmm, can't say I agree with you ThomasGtar.

Legato isn't all too popular on hollowbodies in bebop or rockabilly mainly, IMO, because those who play these guitars and this music don't typically use sustain pedals and the plethora of other rack effects normally employed to properly grab the legato technique. Nor are hollowbodies typically known for having hot/active pickups do to their tendency to want to feedback. Most beboppers/rockabilly cats tend to be purists and are turning back the clock seeking the Scotty Moore sound by using vintage A class National or Supro amplifiers and hand wound vintage style pickups. If money isn't an issue many purchase new boutique amps which blend the old vintage sound with more versatile tone stack controls. A standard setup for this music is a chiming clean tone amp, boost or overdrive pedal like a TS-9, and a DD-3 delay or such. Some guys venture into the old tape delay units but they can be a pain to upkeep. Picking attack is also still very important in this style of music.

Legato just doesn't fit IMO. Would be like Joe Stariani jamming on Rock Around the clock with Brian Setzer.

Finally, Legato is all too often employed by those who still can't pick complex faster guitar lines and don't want to put in the time to learn. They learn the term 'legato' and throw it around among their friends and on internet forums when it's all to often an excuse not to work on their right hand picking technique - just turn that FX box and hot pickups up and move your left hand fingers around on the neck, instant ROCKSTAR! Exact same idea as hiding behind a wall of distortion and delay because clean picking just isn't happening.

sorry for the rant...

ThomasGtar

no problem......I respect your opinion

mr. beaumont

I use a pick and fingers approach on electric (for comping, but also for some single note stuff that alternates between adjacent strings), usually able to "lighten up" nicely that way, because I'm essentially forced to for the sake of balance.

w_lavene

I used to only play Blues realy and only got into Gypsy Jazz two years ago, and did struggle like everyone at first to adapt to rest stroke etc. However even though i now have that style much more comfortable, i find when i now play electric and blues or differnet stly of music the main thing to remember is they are totaly different stlyes, and require a totaly different approach.
Lots of hard work or in my opinion the best way to get the electric tequnique and rest you wrist is to be realy lazy with your right hand at first, that is the style i used to use before i got into Gypsy jazz. Even though i say lazy you can still move fast it is just you have set your arm and relaxed and that is the key i think. Whatever you are trying to play Gypsy jazz/Blues/Rock/Classical/flamenco even if Death metal is your bag(which mine definatly is not) as soon as you get tence and dont relax your right hand everything will go wrong.

HotTinRoof

There is a little crossover between styles - the best tremolo pickers (hard rock/metal name for single string speed picking) use a floating hand technique ala Gypsy style.

Japanese Sandman

This is an interesting topic and one I am facing right now. I currently play in a Django style duo here in Ottawa but I also play in various straight jazz/American Songbook combos in something close to an Ed Bickert style. Talk about mental confusion. I can't take the advice to put the non-Django stuff aside because 2/3rds of the paid gigs are backing singers doing straight jazz. So I muddle through....

One thing that has not been raised yet is how the gypsy picking changes your phrasing in a non-bop direction. I know that when I play a lot of Django and then head out to my gigs to play things like Blame it on my Youth things sound quite different in the first set and over the night I work my way back to my straight jazz style.

That said, I don't see any way around it except to continue to work on the two techniques at the same time. It is a bit like learning two languages at the same time - doable but not optimal.
One happy development is that when playing electric I now lift my right wrist off of the bridge and play hybrid style picking far more effectively. I attribute this entirely to learning to Gypsy pick. I had tried to stop using the bridge as my crutch for the past 20 years but couldn't (it was like quitting smoking) but I am free of it now.

Cheers

bbwood_98

Hi guys,
So I be the bad guy- everyone seems to think the gypsy picking will totally not work for 'bebop', in fact, at least for me I seem to have very little issue using this technique for playing pretty serious lines in classes with some pretty heavy teachers (Barry Harris). It works for me. I use traditional 'gypsy picking' downstrokes when changing, rest stroke, and free hand. Sounds good most of the time too! Just make sure it swings and you arrive in time- which is my issue with legato (it tends to make people playing 'late') playing.
Cheers,
Ben

CalebFSU

I have to agree with Ben here I haven't really had a problem, I went through music school using essentially Gypsy Picking the whole time and never really had a problem, Not that I was killing cats left and right but I graduated!