2 Fingers

252hardt

So, in order to learn Django's solos and to be an authentic gypsy jazz guitarist, do you think it's neccessary to learn with only two fingers? What are your opinions?

Jim Kaznosky

It is not crucial to learn how to play solely with 2 fingers. However, it's a neat exercise to transcribe with 2 fingers, which helps you to see the. Neck in a different light.
If you want to learn rest stroke picking, the gypsy fingerlings with 2 or three help.

That being said, I don't use two fingers whn on a gig.

Jazzaferri

I think using two fingers if you have four working ones is absolutely wrong.

Listen to the Djangos phrasing if you want to .....learn his note choice and timing if you want to.....

He used all his fingers when he had use of them all and he made up for it when he didnt.

As Baro Ferre said it wasnt Django's technique that intimidated him (he felt he was technically as good as Django) it was his musical ideas, his mind that he found so intimidating.

lezard

I wouldn't say it's absolutely wrong, it's a great exercise for changing position, and it demands a certain rhythm that using 4 fingers doesen't, it also let's one really appreciate some of the logic behind django's lines.
I wouldn't learn to play only using 2 fingers but I think it's certainly worthy of some study.
and It's a nice party trick.

Michael Bauer

Wrembel always told me I should try to learn Django's solos with two fingers, so I could understand what Django was doing, and how he used the neck, and how to get the "right" fingerings. After that, there was nothing wrong with using the third finger as required, or when it made sense. But he'd hold up those two fingers and say, "This is where the power is." One thing he was adamant about was that the pinkie should mind its own business and stay away from where the real work was going on. He did let me use it in a couple of places, but I don't think he was happy about it.

I do think that the players who dance around on the fretboard, a la Django, get a more "gypsy" feel to their solos, at least to my ears.

252hardt

Michael Bauer wrote:

Wrembel always told me I should try to learn Django's solos with two fingers, so I could understand what Django was doing, and how he used the neck, and how to get the "right" fingerings. After that, there was nothing wrong with using the third finger as required, or when it made sense. But he'd hold up those two fingers and say, "This is where the power is." One thing he was adamant about was that the pinkie should mind its own business and stay away from where the real work was going on. He did let me use it in a couple of places, but I don't think he was happy about it.

I do think that the players who dance around on the fretboard, a la Django, get a more "gypsy" feel to their solos, at least to my ears.

Thanks for the advice, to all of you. I suppose I can just do a bit of both. Coincidentally, I got Stephane's book (Getting Into Gypsy Jazz) where it said something about using correct fingering, which worried me. Can't believe you met him!!

Jazzaferri

I keep seeing these references to three fingers...there are four fingers on most peoples left hand...use em all. IMO worrying about how someone plays the notes is not nearly as important as truly understanding what notes they play, the timing and the phrasing of their notes. Get that in your head and figure out the easiest way to play that.

I think one wold be way better off being able to sing djangos solos (however badly one sings) than figuring out how to play them with two fngers.

Tis communitynis small and tight knit. Have had masterclasses with and met a number of the leading players.

Michael Bauer

Actually, Wrembel would tell you that you have to do both. Listen, on some licks, four fingers make perfect sense, but on others, I find it simpler to play the lick with two fingers, or three. Maybe it's just me, but if too many fingers are involved, the movement becomes more, not less, complicated. I do both, but more and more, I find myself leaving the little finger out of things except a note here and there. Four fingers seems more for vertical playing, to me, which is great in straight-ahead jazz, but gypsy jazz is more horizontal, and I find that simpler using fewer fingers. It's just a matter of taste, I guess, but I do believe that how and where a note is played effects the sound and feel of the music, and if you want to sound more "gypsy" (that elusive term), playing more horizontally is the way to go.

I think Wrembel's point is that that to get inside Django's head, and to get closer to his sound and feel, you have to see the fretboard the way he did, and that means transcribing using two fingers as much as possible. Nothing wrong with that. To me it opens up a whole different way to see the neck, which is always a good thing. Of course, it helps to have long fingers! In the end, you make it your own anyway. It's not wrong to play with all four...or just two; it just sounds different.

Jim Kaznosky

Wrembel does have me learn Django solos with 2 fingers, mainly because its his contention that Django had an incredible sense of positioning due to his situation and teaches to lead phrases with the first finger. When we're doing other things, its not just based on two fingers.
The other idea is that a huge part of the sound is having strong fingers. All fingers are worked on to gain finger strength.

Passacaglia

jkaz wrote:

Django had an incredible sense of positioning due to his situation and teaches to lead phrases with the first finger.

+1 to this, Jim. That was one of the best little nuggets I took away from DIJ, in Stephane's class.

Lango-Django

[quoteThe other idea is that a huge part of the sound is having strong fingers. All fingers are worked on to gain finger strength][/quote]

How does one increase finger strength? other than just playing the guitar all day and all night... which works for me just fine, but for some reason my wife refuses to get with the program...