2 Fingers

Jim Kaznosky

Well, there's another thread floating around here about practicing the Segovia scales. I think you hit the nail on the head with practicing all the time, but applying pressure to the fingerboard.

anthon_74

2 fingers are wimps. Try it with ONE finger.

no but seriously - It's a fun exercise, but a major pain in the A-S-S. I think it's good to look at specific phrases, and figure out how Django must have done it. For example, I did it with the easily recognizable (and possibly the coolest lick ever) Diminished/minor run Django does at the beginning of Django's tiger (you know, where he runs up and down in E7, then repeats it F7, then back down to E7).
I spent all this time, changing the way I played it, trying to do it Djangos way, which was far more difficult then the way I had first learned it....

And then I watched a video of Stochello showing how to play the lick... And he plays it the way I originally learned it.

All in all, learning the lick different WAYS helped me internalize the lick better, but I ended up doing it the way I first learned it, using most of my available fingers.

I use my pinky gladly.
I seem to remember Stephan Wremble using his pinky at Django in june as well...

by the way 252 hardt - check out Daniel Givone's first book for a great, easily transposable phrasing note map system for Gypsy Jazz.

Michael Bauer

I have seen Wrembel use the pinky, too, but I had to stare him down at a lesson to get him to let me use mine! And staring down Stephane is hard work!

I think his point about finger strength is that the first two fingers are the strongest, so use them where it makes sense. The third finger isn't that much weaker, and does the job, so use it as well. I studied classical for years, but the forth finger is always going to be the weakest, no matter how hard you train it. It makes perfect sense to use it wherever it works for you, but, with the strength required to fret gypsy guitars, especially some of the vintage ones, it isn't going to be the weapon of first resort.

I think whatever works is fine when someone is soloing. But I do appreciate what trying to play a Django solo with two fingers can teach about the fretboard, and about how Django approached his playing. It also makes me appreciate what an absolutely mazing player he was to play what he played with his limitations.

And Anthon, which finger?

chip3174

Here's an earlier thread on finger strength and using two fingers:

viewtopic.php?f=12&t=11302

Jon

For me, the thing about using two fingers is that it leads to make particular, idiomatic decisions when you come up with fingerings or improvise - and that this happens as a natural part of your physical approach (as it would have for Django), not so much as an intellectual, complicated, and hard to remember device.

I think that the physical choices/circumstances we make or find ourselves in impact on our playing more than we know. I've largely dropped my pinky from my gypsy jazz playing, although I use it a lot when playing other styles, and have found it really helped with phrasing and style after Tchavolo.

Jon

Jim Kaznosky

Any exercise can be used to build-up finger strength. It doesn't necessarily mean just scales...could be working on a waltz through all tempos (to the point where you can not play it anymore). It could mean running arpeggios on a set of changes. As long as it is consistent and deliberate, results will happen.
I feel like my left hand is much stronger after changing my practice routine to meet this.