"Aha!" moments studying gypsy jazz

Jon

Jim Kaznosky wrote: »

@Jon, can you explain a bit more or point me to a video?

What in particular?

Jim Kaznosky

Sorry...the Tchavolo spread knuckles thing.

Jon

Jim Kaznosky wrote: »

Sorry...the Tchavolo spread knuckles thing.

Oh, right - you can see that pretty clearly here

It's probably not conscious on his part, but try it - it really stabilises the hand (as opposed to the closed fist grip that others use) and increases accuracy tenfold, which in turn increases volume and improves tone.

Jim Kaznosky

Ahh. I've been experimenting with similar ideas. Thank you.

wim

Matteo wrote: »

Others call them "en escalier" or "ladder", I think Romane does. It's those arpeggios that runs horizontally on the fretboard. Not only diminished ones, but also major, minor, dominant, sixth, ninth, thirteenth, and with all sorts of alterations... Very useful and easy to remember because of their symmetric patterns.

I'm still not sure of the shapes, what is "open" and "symmetrical" about them? Do you have example?
I know that alternating minor thirds and major thirds, 2 notes per string and stepping up the "ladder" one fret each time, gives you a nice m7b5 / m6 / dom9 arpeggio.

Matteo

Yes, that's the idea. But for a m6 arpeggio he alternates seconds and minor thirds, stepping up two frets when changing strings.

An example direct from the book can be found here (see bottom of page 49 for open forms of a Gmaj7 arpeggio): page 48-49

I'm still learning, but I can say that this layout of arpeggios was a real eye opener. In fact, I have just gone back to the book to repeat some of these things.

Jim Kaznosky

You and wim are talking about the same thing, just a different form of the same arpeggio.

wim

stuart wrote: »

This is how I play too - I thought it was wrong! I've been trying to train myself to play with a closed fist, without much success.

Both work. Look at hamfisted guys like romane and robin nolan at one end of the spectrum, and then guys like jimmy rosenberg at the other extreme. They all get a decent sound.

I used to have the fingers uncurled like jimmy, but now I have them sort of loosely curled up - the middle ground, Stochelo (and Django) seem to do similar. The funny thing is it wasn't intentional it just changed over time?!

One thing that should be known is uncurled fingers scrape on your guitar and wear out the top much more, a real problem if you don't like the look of a scratch plate on your guitar. I almost dug through the top of my cigano this way. But with my current guitar I haven't bothered with any scratch plate because I don't really ever touch it anyway.

wim

Matteo wrote: »

Yes, that's the idea. But for a m6 arpeggio he alternates seconds and minor thirds, stepping up two frets when changing strings.

An example direct from the book can be found here (see bottom of page 49 for open forms of a Gmaj7 arpeggio): page 48-49

Ah yes, that's a good one. And I think Jim is right, the alternating m3/M3 one is actually the same pattern as the alternating m3/M2 arpeggio - just depending whether you put the root and the third on the same string, or on separate strings. With the m3/M3 version you are going up one fret on every string change, with the m3/M2 version you go up two frets on every second string change.

maj7 version is helpful too, actually thats the first one I learnt. Don't know the ones for 13th, the trick seems to be less easy if its not a 4-note chord you're spelling..

Matteo

The minor third/major third model was new to me!

the trick seems to be less easy if its not a 4-note chord you're spelling..

Well, you might get three notes on the first string, two on the second, then three again, then two etc. So you still have symmetry, which, for me at least, helps to make sense of the fretboard.