Villa Lobos Preludio n. 1 Arpeggios

Gabriele_C83 · January 2018

Hi Guys,

here my transcription of "Preludio n. 1" by Villa Lobos for gypsy arpeggios study purpose

I hope it can help someone.

Cheers

Jim Kaznosky · January 2018

Thank you for this.

NylonDave · January 2018

Couple of things.
1. Title is Etude no 2.
2. None of the scale positions are efficient or workable. Especially the section with eight consecutive diatonic notes on one string at bar thirteen.
3. There are no fingerings for the left hand (tab is not fingering)
4. There are no indications for picking suggestions.
5. Lots of great places to use open high strings and make this playable missed.
6. Weirdly there are lots of places that might have been sonorous but you have an interval of a fifth or more between an open bass string and the next note. Seems like you just decided to have as many incidences of two notes per string as possible no matter how counterproductive and odd sounding.
7. I have been performing this piece for over twenty years and find little or no application to improvising in Gypsy Jazz.
8. What happened to the multiphonics in the last bar ?
9. Have you heard Prelude no 2 ? It's a bluesy free form Choro which is actually based on Django's style...
10. The repeats were written in by the original editor (Segovia) and are not the composers intention.
11. Angelo wrote a little study in this style but with note choices that actually work for Gypsy picking at speed.

The point of presenting something like this is to have it playable. Modern performers rip through this at around 140 bpm. You don't need to be able to do that of course but when woodshedding you want to spend A LONG TIME, woodshedding different fingering possibilities to get somewhere near that. I don't think you have.

It's a nice idea but I think it needs A LOT more research and time. Maybe you could BUY the collected Villa Lobos edition and get the titles straight and learn to play the piece and get a sense of his style and aesthetic.

Looks like you got a MIDI file and then tweaked the fingerings on a score program.

This is just not how arranging is done.

D.

Jim Kaznosky · January 2018

Dave-bombed.

NylonDave · January 2018

Hmm..

Here is the first bar playable with classic gypsy picking.

Open A downstroke.
C# sixth string downstroke
E fifth string downstroke
A fourth string downstroke
C# fourth string downstroke
E third string downstroke
A second, down
C# 1 D
E 1 D
C# 1 U
A 2 D*
E 3 D*
C# 4 D*
A 4 U
E 5 D
C# E D

Now it might not look pretty but it works. The difficulty would be the three downstrokes in a row asterisked.

They make it a study.

What makes it feasible (up to around 110 for humans 130 for Stochelo) is the fact that the ascending part is so easy and it is very musical to pitch (ie hit each note slightly louder than the last) up to the high E, then in slow practice try and work on a sense of relaxation as the pitch goes down and just let right hand/plectrum (thumbnail for me) bounce off of the strings.

Thats right BOUNCE, like a stick on a snare drum. Two notes per string work can make it too easy for people to lapse back into alternate picking thinking and allow the wrist to flatten. Then there are no rest strokes, thin sound and none of the security of gypsy picking.

It sounds GREAT and if you do the work then the arp is usable and stylistic.

The campanella fingering in the bass is a useful device. Also works with the open E and D of course.

In the villa lobos original the fingerstyle allows all lower notes to ring on and the harmony ensuing makes the piece sound full even though the tone gets thinner on the top strings. I decided on another direction for gypsy picking.

The above might not be pretty but I typed it out myself and made sure it worked etc.

D.

Gabriele_C83 · January 2018

NylonDave wrote: »

Couple of things.
1. Title is Etude no 2.
2. None of the scale positions are efficient or workable. Especially the section with eight consecutive diatonic notes on one string at bar thirteen.
3. There are no fingerings for the left hand (tab is not fingering)
4. There are no indications for picking suggestions.
5. Lots of great places to use open high strings and make this playable missed.
6. Weirdly there are lots of places that might have been sonorous but you have an interval of a fifth or more between an open bass string and the next note. Seems like you just decided to have as many incidences of two notes per string as possible no matter how counterproductive and odd sounding.
7. I have been performing this piece for over twenty years and find little or no application to improvising in Gypsy Jazz.
8. What happened to the multiphonics in the last bar ?
9. Have you heard Prelude no 2 ? It's a bluesy free form Choro which is actually based on Django's style...
10. The repeats were written in by the original editor (Segovia) and are not the composers intention.
11. Angelo wrote a little study in this style but with note choices that actually work for Gypsy picking at speed.

The point of presenting something like this is to have it playable. Modern performers rip through this at around 140 bpm. You don't need to be able to do that of course but when woodshedding you want to spend A LONG TIME, woodshedding different fingering possibilities to get somewhere near that. I don't think you have.

It's a nice idea but I think it needs A LOT more research and time. Maybe you could BUY the collected Villa Lobos edition and get the titles straight and learn to play the piece and get a sense of his style and aesthetic.

Looks like you got a MIDI file and then tweaked the fingerings on a score program.

This is just not how arranging is done.

D.

Many thanks for your words. I'm really sorry for wrong title and other things.
I've really appreciated all your points.
Thanks again

NylonDave · January 2018

Gabriele_C83 wrote: »

NylonDave wrote: »

Couple of things.

I've really appreciated all your points.
Thanks again

Hats off to you young man !

I love Villa Lobos. Fred Noad did a collected edition of all his solo works and a physical copy should be on every guitarist's shelfs.

I hope you get some ideas from the single bar above that I wrote out.
It will not be possible to get this piece to tempo with Gypsy picking but it is an excellent choice to keep looking at as your concept of picking and the gypsy sound develop.

One last thing, the dominant seventh chain works perfectly well in fixed position (like the original) with gypsy picking. For example the E9 chord

D6 D5 D4 D4 D3 2D 2D 1D
1D 1U 2D 2U 3D 4D 4U 5D 6D

As well as sounding great this fingering has the benefit of being completely 'in the chord' ie it will be easy to choose notes from it whilst improvising. Shifting every two notes makes it real hard to 'see' what chord we are on.

Happy studying !

juanderer · January 2018

NylonDave wrote: »

Couple of things.
1. Title is Etude no 2.
2. None of the scale positions are efficient or workable. Especially the section with eight consecutive diatonic notes on one string at bar thirteen.
3. There are no fingerings for the left hand (tab is not fingering)
4. There are no indications for picking suggestions.
5. Lots of great places to use open high strings and make this playable missed.
6. Weirdly there are lots of places that might have been sonorous but you have an interval of a fifth or more between an open bass string and the next note. Seems like you just decided to have as many incidences of two notes per string as possible no matter how counterproductive and odd sounding.
7. I have been performing this piece for over twenty years and find little or no application to improvising in Gypsy Jazz.
8. What happened to the multiphonics in the last bar ?
9. Have you heard Prelude no 2 ? It's a bluesy free form Choro which is actually based on Django's style...
10. The repeats were written in by the original editor (Segovia) and are not the composers intention.
11. Angelo wrote a little study in this style but with note choices that actually work for Gypsy picking at speed.

The point of presenting something like this is to have it playable. Modern performers rip through this at around 140 bpm. You don't need to be able to do that of course but when woodshedding you want to spend A LONG TIME, woodshedding different fingering possibilities to get somewhere near that. I don't think you have.

It's a nice idea but I think it needs A LOT more research and time. Maybe you could BUY the collected Villa Lobos edition and get the titles straight and learn to play the piece and get a sense of his style and aesthetic.

Looks like you got a MIDI file and then tweaked the fingerings on a score program.

This is just not how arranging is done.

D.