Gi bill to study gypsy jazz?

kungfumonk007

@bbwood_98 I am actually thinking something along that lines. I am just 2 hours north of you doing a program at Rensselaer and there is an NYU program that would pair well with what I am doing now. I would really like to try to study with any of the rhythm future guys and I know Max is in Brooklyn now.

bbwood_98

@kungfumonk007 yes, Max is in BKLN; So am i lol, and Josh K. Stephane W. is in maplewood, Lisa Lui in Brooklyn, So is Dennis Pol; plus a lot of people come here.

I would totally not shy away from some straight ahead training and sessions, as that will go a long way toward things, and some of it especially here in the city can be very fun and very good playing!

What NYU program?

B.

kungfumonk007

I am doing Architectural Acoustics at Rensselaer and doing contract work for Cinesamples and the NYU program would be Music Technology. It all fits together very nicely as the arch acoustics MS at Rensselaer is very stem based, lots of learning about modeling and such. I really think all this education is a bit absurd but as long as the govt is paying me to do it definitely no reason not to use all 4 years of benefits.

I went to Northern Colorado for my MM in music. Went in wanting to learn all about jazz, left hating jazz. Much of it had to do with their guitar instructor who is kind of. . . well . . . wouldn't be nice of me to elaborate. So many of the students too were really. . . Well. . . I just think the whole "jazz studies" world is really broken. I also think you can delineate between jazz musicians and "jazz studies" musicians and I just really hate the "jazz studies" musicians. They also very much look down on gypsy jazz as unserious dance music they used to play in the 30s.

billyshakes

They also very much look down on gypsy jazz as unserious dance music they used to play in the 30s.

This sort of attitude is exactly why the label "jazz" could be off-putting to many people and why it isn't as mainstream popular as it was in the 30s as a style of music. When I tell people I play in a band and they ask what kind, I usually say swing jazz or something similar. By appending the "swing" label, it invokes images in most minds of swing dancing and its various revivals. This was seen as a fun and social activity and is approachable. When I've said just "jazz", I get disinterest or disengagement. Snobbery and pretentiousness would be images it evokes. Flurries of notes. Broadly generalizing, of course, but, yes, I do believe that gypsy jazz and the good folks that practice it seem much more approachable.

bbwood_98

"I went to Northern Colorado for my MM in music. Went in wanting to learn all about jazz, left hating jazz. Much of it had to do with their guitar instructor who is kind of. . . well . . . wouldn't be nice of me to elaborate. So many of the students too were really. . . Well. . . I just think the whole "jazz studies" world is really broken. I also think you can delineate between jazz musicians and "jazz studies" musicians and I just really hate the "jazz studies" musicians. They also very much look down on gypsy jazz as unserious dance music they used to play in the 30s."

Yup. I have sadly heard this so many times. It's stupid (To be clear, the school failed you; and the teachers are egotists). Also, likely that the teachers can't play in the style (and are afraid to try, even though they could likely help you improve and work on it if they are any good as teachers - without altering their technique) . I totally agree in the 'academic' 'jazz' world the education is often broken (intellect over heart, hands over ears, I can play stuff because I can conceive of it, not because I hear it). I would say that at least some of the schools/teachers in the NYC metro have exposure to Django, and would be able to help you play this music. SUNY Purchase Sax teacher Albert Rivera and I play in a band together with Doug Munro that does Django's music. The faculty at Queens College will push you, but are really skilled and from my read all about self direction to some extent or another (I have only hung/played a little with Paul Bolenbeck, but super nice cat - and hell of a guitarist!) (my wife got her masters in Jazz performance there). Also, many of these teachers worked with/studied with the great old masters and have a somewhat different perspective on jazz education because of it.

"This sort of attitude is exactly why the label "jazz" could be off-putting to many people and why it isn't as mainstream popular as it was in the 30s as a style of music. When I tell people I play in a band and they ask what kind, I usually say swing jazz or something similar. By appending the "swing" label, it invokes images in most minds of swing dancing and its various revivals. This was seen as a fun and social activity and is approachable. When I've said just "jazz", I get disinterest or disengagement. Snobbery and pretentiousness would be images it evokes. Flurries of notes. Broadly generalizing, of course, but, yes, I do believe that gypsy jazz and the good folks that practice it seem much more approachable."

Yup. I have sadly heard this so many times as well! Not sure I have a good answer to this one, but was talking yesterday about sessions here in the city and how they are often 'throw downs' that have nothing to do with making great music; just how many notes you can fit in instead of supporting the other players and inviting the audience to enjoy themselves/be involved. One of my teachers Barry Harris used to remind us often that jazz is or came from dance music - if you are not tapping your foot . . . well . . . you are doing it wrong). Anyhow, when asked what kind of music, I lately have been saying 'Django's Music'. . .

kungfumonk007

@bbwood_98 okay Ben you convinced me. Honestly though I don't know if I will make it in based on my repertoire. I think I will submit "Made in France" and "Nuages" which will be fine, but if I make it through video audition I don't know what I will do having to play with a student ensemble playing straight up jazz. My experience with student ensembles is their time is super wishy-washy, plus I will already be out of my element. I noticed Cyrille Aimee graduated from their program. She is AWESOME!

paulmcevoy75

What's your goal in studying Gypsy Jazz academically? It's kind of a profoundly nonacademic music, seeing that basically no players emerged having studied it in a collegiate setting.

My suggestion would be to find a really strong and creative jazz program and be the Gypsy Jazz guy there. They'd have a program path you could follow and you'd be a stronger musician for it. A more varied program would give you different perspectives on technique, theory, etc.

NEC now has Julian Lage teaching...that's pretty crazy. William Patterson is still good I think?

Seeing as how so many great gypsy jazz players excel at playing straight ahead jazz it seems like being well rounded would be 'in the tradition'?

billyshakes

I think he is just trying to use his GI Bill benefit studying something he likes.

kungfumonk007

Yes - :o) I am just trying to use my last 2 years of gi bill benefits. I already have the degees I want for income so it is just gravy.

bbwood_98

@kungfumonk007

Sent a Dm, and yeah, Purchase has had a bunch of great singers and other instrumentalists graduate from there. (Samara Joy also finished there).

"Seeing as how so many great gypsy jazz players excel at playing straight ahead jazz it seems like being well rounded would be 'in the tradition'?"

Man, I don't know about this - While I studied jazz and continue to do so - I am a rhythm guitar specialist, and really enjoy the work of practicing & performing just that.

B.