What are the best GJ scenes in North America?

voutoreenie

We could always use more players in Milwaukee but the scene is pretty small...think there's maybe 6-8 of us at most?? Otoh, we definitely get cold weather...although then again it's 51F in late December as I type this, almost shorts weather even lmao

djazzy

I've always been astounded that there isn't more GJ in New England. College towns and $! It could very well be that those two mean something a lot different than when I was growing up. But still. And a good number of players already come from there too so I'm still puzzled. I would think either Denver or Boulder too but my experience there from visiting every summer (10-15 years ago) hasn't shown much.

On the topic of NYC & the GJ -- I would be inclined to cast a vote *against* it. Talent & names are here (mainly Brooklyn, at least in terms of GJ) but.... perhaps there is too much talent, too many names, and too many crowds here as well (if you get my point)? As I'm sure you're aware of, its also too fucking expensive, too fucking noisy & batshit crazy for it not to regularly test your sanity. And the city is kind of eating itself in various ways without much light at the end of the tunnel. I could be wrong though. I'm sure very much of it depends on hopes and expectations. My skin may just be thinner than most. 🙂

wim

That's the thing with NYC, when you have a city with a lot of creative types then it becomes an attractor for more creative types, there's a positive feedback loop there. Paris being the prime example of this effect, the Mecca!

Seems like Long Beach LA has a good scene. Gage, Luca, Kully, Christi.. all those cats always seem booked and busy

Montreal also has a good scene

marcelodamon

I have lived and worked all over the US. As I am from Illinois, I first met Alphonse Ponticelli, when I was a kid, in Chicago, and played a few gigs with him around Chicago. I haven't been there (Illinois or Chicago) in quite some time, but I am pretty sure that the governor of the state, and the mayor of Chicago have pretty much run the state and the city to the ground. Ever increasing taxes, and worse and worse quality of life in Chicago. As such, my advice would be to stay away.

I moved to where I am at now, which is Buffalo, this last July for work (I'm a doctor of emergency medicine, and an epidemiologist at the University at Buffalo), and have already made friends with Dean Gionis from the Hot Club of Buffalo. I have even played a gig with the group just recently, and they are a rock solid group. However, I think they are the only gypsy jazz group in town. However, I agree with JSanta (whom I reached out to on Facebook - Hi Jim), between Buffalo and Rochester, I think it's a good place to be musically. I will be here for quite some time, and plan to play out more with the HCOB, and the fact they have lots of gigs lined up should tell you how musically friendly Buffalo is. I understand you're a luthier too, so should you make it here to Buffalo, I have Selmer #561; should you wish to study it. I also have several other gypsy jazz guitars (2004 AJL, Dell Arte Macias Favino, 2024 Cattiaux Swing Chorus, Bob Holo traditional model, RJ Aylward Favino style, AJL Gipsy Fire).

However, before I moved here, I lived in Mississippi, somewhat close to New Orleans. There is a good scene down there, but then you have to contend with the heat, as well as the possibility of a hurricane once again coming through and creating apocalyptic living conditions in the wake of absolute destruction from said hurricane. Prior to that, I lived in Washington, and despite Djangofest Northwest being in the region, there wasn't that much going on, in the way of gigs and a "scene" in Seattle. Portland, Oregon has a lot of players and groups, but a lot has changed since I last lived there (2013-2014), with regard to living conditions (cost of living, crime, homelessness, and the like).

With all that being said, I agree with JSanta. Buffalo or Rochester might be your best bet.

Let me know if you have any questions, and if you do decide to move here.

Cordially,

Marcelo Damon

Gouch

Madison WI is the current GJ Center of Excellence in the Western Hemisphere.

Namaste.

🙏

tbleen

While @djazzy isn't wrong about his points on NYC, I believe there are many pluses to what he's saying. Too much talent & too many names? Well the fact that you can step out almost any given nights and see some high level players in intimate spaces (Stephane, Olli, Max, Charlie, Adrien, Dennis or Dion now). We miss Brad! There are many other great local players in this specific style that are performing constantly (Alex Simon, Asher Ben'or, Diego Campo to name a just a few). Then there is a whole tier of folks like myself that have day jobs but take music very seriously, and even play professionally. There are usually enough people in town to call for having an impromptu jam hang. There are actually two weekly acoustic jams. Not to forget the tons of great violinists (they outnumber guitarists) , straight jazz guitarists, a thriving trad scene, that often intersect.

I guess If you are a full-time professional musician looking to compete for gigs, surely I can see this can all be a massive negative. However if you are a serious novice that just wants to be in the scene more, maybe start a side project, NYC is great for that.

Ok, the crowds (are we talking audiences?) do suck a bit here. Many places that hire are bars and restaurants where everyone is on dates/socializing with friends and don't even pay attention to the music. But not always the case.

Aside from the music scene, @djazzy is correct NYC is eating itself alive financially (we are just implementing congestion pricing to enter Manhattan, so say goodbye to some of your pay when you enter the city by car). Some gigs will cost maybe 20 bucks of tolls to reach if you have to cross a major bridge or tunnel. Or maybe you can ditch the car entirely. Not sure where you parents are located on Long Island, but the LIRR covers a lot of area (until you get to far east end of Suffolk). Even then, cheaper to rent a Zipcar or something for day trips (tolls and gas included on those).

You might need roommates to make this place work. I finally got my own place after 15 years here, and it's ridiculous $$ but I have a day job. I hear rent in most places around the country has almost caught up to NYC prices though, so I don't know if it's much sticker shock here. (My hometown in the Hudson Valley is more expensive than where I am in Queens)

But usually in places with higher cost of living, you have more economic opportunity...in theory. More potential customers for a local business venture, or odd job opportunites like picking up bartending at a busy spot and making cash on the side. Not sure what your work plan is when you move. Make guitars? Because seems like you could do that anywhere. If you can put up with the drab scenery of the NYC suburb area (NJ or Nassau County, or Staten Island), maybe you can do more space and shop in a place there. Or there might even be a shared shop space in East Williamsburg/Bushwick, similiar to Mile End, that I don't know about. Anyways good luck, and reach out if you want more advice on this area.

tbleen

Oh, and just thought...I've also heard of things happening around the Troy, NY area (north Hudson Valley). I think you have Matt Munisteri and Brad Brose in the Hudson Valley, and that's also near Saratoga where there's some action with Jonathan Greene. From there you can get to Long Island in 4 hours drive maybe, and a NYC is manageable is managable for an impromptu visit if a great player is in town you want to catch.

djazzy

Yeah, I think @tbleen makes a better case than I ever could. I wouldn’t want my earlier comments to be the only ones out there. I’d only clarify a little. The city could be good — very good! — for playing & hearing GJ if you’re willing to put with all the rest. But for a luthier specializing in making/selling GJ guitars I still think a move here may not be great idea.

Buco

From what I heard, many luthiers supplement their income with service work. NYC scene would probably be better than most for that.

paulmcevoy75

Thanks guys. This is seriously, seriously helpful. This might be long and TMI (and also feel free to talk about other scenes in this thread, this doesn't have to only be about me).

Couple thoughts: Chicago, lack of gypsy jazz scene not withstanding, is an amazing place in my very limited experience. I was there 2 Augusts in a row for the Fretboard Summit and it was just astounding how nice it was. People seem very friendly and it was clean, public transport was awesome and there was a great energy there that I loved. I was in a pretty nice neighborhood and I know that Chicago has its problems but just wanted to say that it was amazing and I think I would be really happy living there (other than the distance to LI thing...but flying is pretty easy).

Anyway, barring Chicago:

I work as a nurse two 12 hour shifts a week right now on the Vascular Access Team which has been great for supporting the luthier habit as sales have been in a word, glacially slow (I also haven't really been working very hard on selling things, I'm working very hard on improving instruments, getting feedback and refining what I'm doing). I'm not generally interested in doing repairs, I've tried it and it really soaks up a ton of time and energy and for me it's a very different rhythm from making instruments. I do some repair work on spec (like the Bleen Busato) when it interests me, it's mostly educational and when I think I can flip something that's cool and I can make it better and learn something from it.

Not to get too gritty but I'm 49, single, and don't have a ton of money. I have about 90k as a downpayment for a house and a bit more cash in the bank but next to nothing for retirement. Not that I really believe that retirement for me will be likely anyway or even really desired. But I would like to ideally buy a place that I could live and work out of for not too much money and kind of have a happy/poor life. Right now, even if I wanted to stay in Maine, that's just not possible. Housing prices are absolutely insane here. I have a very cheap apartment that isn't wonderful in certain ways but if I left it, I would pay double the rent, easily. My shop space is very affordable and that's a plus. But in truth I am solidly bored of this place. It has been super hard here to make friends and there's not the sort of scene of much of anything that I'm interested in. I think partly that's because it's become so expensive in town that venues are much tenser about everything making $$$$$$ so there's a lot less going on.

Certainly there's a lot of my issues with being here that are my issues, but I think I can say that I don't think this place is working for me at all AND I can't afford to live here anymore. I will probably stay here till the early winter, enjoy the summer and make sure that the country is still somewhat functional before I move.

The things I'm looking for:

1) affordable place to live where I could have a house and a 450ish square foot shop space very affordably

2) Active music scene both with local people and touring artists

3) also a GJ scene

4) Hopefully some nature nearby

5) Good hospital system where I would have some choice and variety in the nursing job I ended up in

6) Somewhat younger population than Maine (that's easy because it's the oldest population in the country)

I think NYC is not doable for me. Just way too much instability there for housing and constantly working just to kind of maintain things.

It was interesting hearing about Buffalo and Rochester. I'll have to look into the hospital systems. Rochester seems very affordable. I have a friend from there who just talks about it being a S-hole but I think she has other issues with her family and stuff. And I'm sure it does have its problems but in looking it up people seem to like it. I have some family in Buffalo. I really love Montreal, I'd love to be closer to it but I wouldn't be any further away than I am now.

Milwaukee and Madison for me personally are probably too far away.

@tbleen Hudson Valley is definitely interesting, I think might be pricier than ideal but I'll check it out, I thought about it in the past and it's beautiful.

@marcelodamon oddly I was an ER nurse traveler for like 15 years...I might need to check in with you sometime about hospitals around there. I did call one hospital in Buffalo and asked if I might be able to get a Vascular Access job straight away but she said because it was a union hospital they usually go to internal candidates. I think it might be a problem to find another VAT team job which sucks because it's awesome for me.

@JSanta Thanks for your Rochester thoughts, what does your wife do? Are the Rochester and Buffalo systems connects? Are there preferable hospitals?

Sorry for the 9 different threads here but it was quite helpful to me.