DG-255- IS IT WORTH IT?

Josh Hegg

I think he is saying the saga bridge is to round on the top. Not enough slope. Too heavy and over built.

Cheers,
Josh

drolling

Very true. Like most factory made low-end guitars, everything except the flimsy tailpiece is over built. My Gitanes weigh a ton when compared to the more refined, hand built selmacs I've played over the years. They're constructed to withstand the abuse that guitars are subject to in most music stores. I shine mine up with windex. Fine furniture/instrument grade polishes just don't mix with polyurethane. A strong wind picked my 250M right out of it's stand one day and slammed it into the hard wood floor of my studio - What a sound! Astonishingly, not a scratch. I've taken to keeping it in its case since then, but had it been a really 'good' guitar, I'm quite certain it would have been a total write-off.

zav

Hi!

Craig, thanks for the tips, after some tests now I'm sure, that the buzz problem I've mentioned is just because of loose truss rod (open strings, around harmonics etc, and it's even seems to me that I could locate the source of buzz by my ears - in the middle of the neck, around frets 5 - 8 ). I think I'll ask one guitar luthier in Moscow to solve the problem, but after some time (I would like to see first, may be the situation will change with the right strings, because of the different tension; and wanna also collect some more tuning-setup things to ask him to do at once).

So, my question now - is about bridges once again. I've contacted Maurice Dupont, and the price for his bridge No 2 seems quiet reasonable to me. My question is - how difficult is to setup his bridge to fit my Gitane well? Is the job "difficult for a skilled amateur", or not? Well, in any case I could ask my luthier to do this when I'll return to Moscow (actually, I'm at working on France-Swiss board (near Geneva) now, and playing my Gitanes in the evenings ).

I've also asked Maurice about the price for his Selmer-type tailpiece, but it's turned to be higher that mentioned here US-made ones, as I'm not shure that it's reasonable to put a lot of money in Gitane - I'll try to upgrade factory-build Gitane's one (now I already have some ideas), or order more cheep one.

Thanks for all!!!
Anton

drolling

Hey zav, I've orderd number 1 bridges from both Stew-Mac and **** (approx. $40 US) and they were both identical ebonized rosewood 5 1/8" long x 9/16" deep x 11/16" high. I think this is a standard for selmac guitars in general (but not Gitanes) so I had to remove about 3/32" off each end to fit between the moustaches. Most people use a file, but I preferred to go slow so I used a piece of fine sandpaper wrapped around a block of wood.

The number 1 is still way too high for a Gitane as the fretboard is much closer to the top of the guitar than most designs. The best way to bring down the height but retain the correct curvature of the feet (even contact is crucial) is a trick I learned here. I taped a piece of sandpaper to the top of the guitar between the soundhole and the moustache ends and gently rubbed the bridge back and forth, checking periodically by restringing the high and low E. The most difficult part for me was curving the top of the bridge to match the fretboard radius and then notching the strings slots. It turned out far better than the stock bridge. Guitar plays & sounds much better,

Good luck with this project.

EDIT: zav, I just remembered I also ordered a DR tailpiece ($50 US) from Alain. These are supposed to be the best, but it's really not very much thicker than the stock Gitane and also dips down somewhat when the strings are brought up to pitch.
dr

zav

Hi, All!

I've got Dupont No 2. Now I'm wondering, why I read here recomendations to order No 2, not No 1 - my No 2 is TOO HIGH for my 255 (so I'm informing all further "upgraders" about that ).

The most difficult part for me was curving the top of the bridge to match the fretboard radius and then notching the strings slots.

How should I low the hight of my bridge (besides of the mentioned procedure to make the feet contact the body well) - cutting the top, or both sides to remain "blade-knife" form (drolling, what you did actually to get the top match the fretboad?...)? How deep string slots could be?

P.S. After putting shims (now I have about 3.8 mm action and my fingers got into the way of playing with it, by the way - the sound's changed SUGNIFICANTLY even with the shims of very poor-quality wood) and Argentinge strings the tailpiece is not curving so dangerously any more, as it was in "from factory" variant - no need of soft material between the tailpiece and the top, and so I haven't done any upgrades of it yet...


Thanks,
Anton

djangology

yeah, you order a extra high bridge so that you can cut it down to exactly where you want the action. its better than getting one that is too short and having to shim it up right?

drolling

drolling wrote:

Hey zav, I've orderd number 1 bridges from both Stew-Mac and **** (approx. $40 US) and they were both identical ebonized rosewood 5 1/8" long x 9/16" deep x 11/16" high. I think this is a standard for selmac guitars in general (but not Gitanes) so I had to remove about 3/32" off each end to fit between the moustaches. Most people use a file, but I preferred to go slow so I used a piece of fine sandpaper wrapped around a block of wood.

The number 1 is still way too high for a Gitane as the fretboard is much closer to the top of the guitar than most designs. The best way to bring down the height but retain the correct curvature of the feet (even contact is crucial) is a trick I learned here. I taped a piece of sandpaper to the top of the guitar between the soundhole and the moustache ends and gently rubbed the bridge back and forth, checking periodically by restringing the high and low E. The most difficult part for me was curving the top of the bridge to match the fretboard radius and then notching the strings slots. It turned out far better than the stock bridge. Guitar plays & sounds much better,

Good luck with this project.

EDIT: zav, I just remembered I also ordered a DR tailpiece ($50 US) from Alain. These are supposed to be the best, but it's really not very much thicker than the stock Gitane and also dips down somewhat when the strings are brought up to pitch.
dr

Zav, I ordered all 3 bridges to experiment with and suggested the number one because it's taller than any Gitane bridge I know of. Can exchange your no. 2 for a no. 1?

The 1 will still have to be sanded down on the bottom and radiiused on the top. I used a file & a piece of sandpaper wrapped around a block to radius the crown. I'm sure that luthiers use a template for this kind of precision work, but I just 'eye-balled' it. I cut the string slots with a very small file for the wound strings and a very sharp X-Acto knife for the plain strings. The slot should not be very deep, maybe half the diameter of the string.

Bob Holo

http://www.frets.com/FRETSPages/Luthier ... tfeet.html Here is a good method for fitting bridge feet.

I go one step farther than this... I bought "Low Tack" masking tape (can get it at drafting stores, art stores, fine woodworking shops...)

I unstring the guitar or loosen the strings and pull them to the side... I cover the area around the bridge with a single layer of low-tack masking tape (to protect the top)... put a piece of sandpaper on top of that low-tack masking tape - and tape the sandpaper to the surrounding low-tack tape with normal masking tape. Now I have a work surface that is exactly the same shape as the guitar top - covered with sandpaper - and the finish is protected. Now I can concentrate and use both hands to do my sanding.

Be careful because unless you grip really low on the bridge, you will rock the bridge as you sand and wind up with a rounded foot. That's part of what Frank is trying to remedy here with the jack-knife technique...

Long story short - go slow - don't rock - and it takes a LOT of effort to take off much material, so either carefully remove most of what you need to remove with other tools and do the final finishing on the guitar - or if the bridge is just way too high, get the lower bridge... because the last thing you want to do is completely shave the legs off the bridge to get it low enough - it won't work properly unless it has those two feet. Unless you have a lot of woodworking experience, you probably don't want to try reducing the bridge height by reducing the top of the bridge, though that is what a luthier or tech will do if you take it to them. If you screw up the top of the bridge, one of two (maybe both) things will happen... 1.) your tone will get dull or zither-like (buzzy) and/or you will start breaking a lot of strings.

zav

So, working all this day I´ve found no problem to reduce the hight of the bridge by reducing it´s top. Now I´ve done all the work, but I have to do some more later for the better contact of the bottom and the guitar body (as I have ~4.4 mm action there is still some reserve of the hight).
Thanks for all!!!

Anton

zav

After playing with a new bridge couple of days, I would like to tell the guys who are still in a doubt if change the bridge or not:

1. You could get one step closer to THAT sound with the traditional bridge!
2. If you have to use shims - make them from the really good wood, but in any case it will kill your tone more or less.
3. If you want to have an action of about 4mm (as I do) - now I also think that Dupont No 2 IS a right choice - you get some freedom and flexibility, which is important when improving the guitar top-bridge contact (or if you wanna work with the top to improve intonation).
4 !!! You have an "Gypsy Picking" book and you are learning rest-stroke technique??? Man, to do it most effective- imo you HAVE TO set a 3.75-4 mm action and the best way -is to put a new bridge; I wanna say, that I've got a really nice FEELING of the rest stroke technique only with a new bridge, 4 mm action and gauge 10 strings!!!

Cheers!
Anton