Gitane Signature models vs. boutique Selmacs

MichaelHorowitz

Frans wrote:

For me the sound is 90 % dictated by the player,

I'd say more like 70% the player. A really good guitar will make a difference, even for the best players. Romane's recordings over the last few years mostly feature his vintage Busato which is noticeably better sounding then the Duponts he had played in the past.

I remember at Samois Stochelo was jamming with a huge crowd around him. Somebody handed him some piss poor guitar...you couldn't hear a thing. He played one song on it and then someone handed him a Favino and BAM, every note shot out like a cannon. You don't always get such a huge result, but I think it's important to realize there are real quantifiable differences between guitars.

And a personal anecdote...we do one regular gig which we had always played amplified because we could never be heard with the acoustics (we were playing some nice Duponts). Recently, we started bringing some vintage Busatos to the gig and all of a sudden we didn't need the PA anymore! The audience loved hearing the acoustics all on their own....

It's not just about volume, but about the frequency response and tonal characteristic of the guitar. In an empty room two guitars may sound like they have the same volume. But in a noisy jam all of a sudden the very bright, brash one with little bass and a "simple" tone cuts like a knife. But the full sounding, bassy one with the complex rounded tone can't be heard at all.

Generally, it's the really old vintage guitars that have this sort of "magic" high end that really serves you well in jams. It does seem to have something to do with the aged woods as the Dupount Vieille Reserve and the Hahl Super Deluxe are the only new guitars that have that characteristic...at least that I've found.

But in the end...if you're a good player you can make just about anything work. A Yugo will get you from point A to point B just as well as a Mercedes....but the Mercedes is soo nice!

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dlincoln

Michael, thanks for all your input. We probably all get interested in these guitars because of Django, and then you learn that there's a range of instruments, with unique personalities, to consider. It's not like bluegrass, for example, where a D-28 stands as a pretty firm standard for what acoustic guitar tone is all about.

If there are any JJ DG-300 owners out there that have played boutique guitars, and can offer any feedback regarding it's relative strengths and weaknesses, I'd love to hear from you.

Thanks for all the input.

blindjimmy

Hello, i brought my Gitane jj300 to the new mexico djangofest this past october, and during stephanes workshop , the rhythm player for swing from paris , who posts on the uk django swingpage under phydeux3, used my guitar to play rhythm for stephane 's examples. Up until that point, i raelly liked the guitar, but had not been able to get THAT SOUND out of the thing. But in this mans hands, the guitar sounded exactly how we want them to. Other people even came up and commented on the rhythm sound he got. My point is , as we've heard over and over, so much of the sound comes from the player. That relatively inexpensive guitar, upgraded with josh's bridge from this site, really seemed to hold it's own in the right hands. That didn't stop me from buying a Manouche 14 fret d hole from John Vickers while we were there. The person who i sold the JJ to , a really hot young player here in phoenix named Ryan Picone, was telling me how he was in a jam with 12 guitar players, and he had the loudest guitar. Someone asked if he was amplified. There was even a Park guitar in attendance. Ryan compares the JJand the Manouche as sun and moon, the JJ being brightar and the Manouche being darker. I just like the Manouche more and more every day i play it, and i can finally get something besides a quack out of it. It takes some work, but those rich sounds are in the guitar, i just cant play too delicately, no nancying about will be tolerated by the Manouche d hole, it is definately a woman who wants a man with a firm hand telling her what to do. Does anyone else here think that these Selmer style guitars make telecasters seem absolutely hospitable and forgiveing by comparisson? My playing has never sounded as naked as on a selmac, which i enjoy.

BluesBop Harry

I'm with Stringswinger on this, stay on your Gitane until you really feel you've outgrown it and then move up to a Dupont or Favino.
Gitanes are really cool for the price but you really get into a whole other realm with a Dupont.
They are a lot more responsive, play better and definitely sound better.

I agree that the player's the most important factor, I saw Sebastien Giniaux playing on a cheap Aria and he sounded loud and beautiful, I played that same guitar later and in my hands it sounded like crap. But then again when Sebastien was playing his own guitar, a Marin, he sounded a hundred times better than on the Aria.

The D500 is a good enough guitar, if you want to trade up don't go for another Gitane or any other asian made guitar, get something that won't make you want to change guitars again and that'll leave no doubt in your mind you really did trade up.

Lastly, I believe it's good to grow up as a player on an instrument that makes you work to get good tone, then the tone comes from your hands. That will really shine when you get a guitar that "plays itself".

Phydeaux3

Well.. that's one hell of a compliment from Blindjimmy. Thank you very much indeed. I was extremely surprised in the feel and sound of that Gitane; I had to double check that it was a Gitane.
Cheers
Brett