why is it that this sounds out of the chord

T1mothy

The part when Adrien takes the solo theres many phrases at the start (well its a continuous solo but) where it sounds slightly out of the chord. Creates a lot of tension in my ear and I love it. Could somebody shed some light on it? Id love to understand the process of choosing certain notes over others to achieve this specific sound. All Im able to do is learn it note by note and see it as a sequence of a lot of notes. Bit of theory to support it with in my head would be greatly appreciated. Thanks a bunch
Tim

Bob Holo

Adrien uses a lot of non-chord tone series to create dissonance. I'm not a music theory person, but I've listened to his work for many years and my impression is that he likes to express extended ideas and he withholds resolution in order to keep the idea active until he wants it to "land".

First time I ever heard him do it was about 1:15 into this clip where he goes off on an idea and then ends it by modulating upward. It stopped me cold. It was like... um... what? I had to go back and listen to it a few times to get it into my head. If there was a single moment that I fell for his music... that was probably it.

dennis

he basically invents chordprogressions on the spot o improvise over even if they have nothing to do w the original changes, and then he resolves to release the tension... he talks about it n his instructional video produced by some asshole

Jazzaferri

Go to HalGalper.com. Read as many of his articles as you can. Then go to YouTube and search Hal Galper Masterclass and watch all of them.

Don't be put off by his comments that long eighth note solos are adolescent by nature. Coltrane did lots of em. Being an adolescent is part of growing up. He's right in that.....just as Miles was right when he said never complete an idea...let the rhythm section complete it......much of GJ is still in its musical adolescence...with all the enthusiasm and focus on speed. Not right not wrong....it's just where it is. In order to not play long eighth note solo's you have first learn how to play em.

Where he ends up is you have to hear the complete solo in your head and only play the minimum amount necessary.

Jazzaferri

This from an interview with Harold "Hal" Galper, jazz pianist who played with Dizzy and Cannonball Phil Woods Jerry Bergonzi and a host of others. A great musical educator too.

“The first night in the band, playing with the great Dizzy Gillespie, I was all over the place with notes. And he just eased over to me and calmly said, “You know, the sign of a mature musician is when you learn what not to play; what to leave out.’ It took me a while to do.

Dizzy loved to teach; he was a natural born teacher. I learned a lot of little things that you wouldn’t get in a music school. The things he would show me, you’d have to practice on the gig. That’s probably what they mean when they say, on-the-job training. I don’t think you could get the full essence of some of the things he showed me by just practicing at home.”

Lango-Django

"Never complete an idea, let the rhythm section complete it."

Am I the only doofus with zero comprehension of what Miles Davis was talking about here?

Please elaborate on this, Jay?

Jazzaferri

Will, @Lango-Django imagine you are playing a phrase that would carry on over 4 bars. Instead of finishing the phrase bar 4 beat 4 finish the phrase on bar 4 beat one and let the rhythm section finish it on beats 2,3 and 4.

bopster

@Lango-Django : "Shave and a haircut ........." and let the mind answer with "two bits."

BluesBop Harry

T1mothy wrote: »

The part when Adrien takes the solo theres many phrases at the start (well its a continuous solo but) where it sounds slightly out of the chord. Creates a lot of tension in my ear and I love it. Could somebody shed some light on it?

If you give me the specific time in the video I could try and tell you what it is

T1mothy

@BluesBop Harry I guess it was the Bb minor arpeggio played over the Bb dim chord that struck me most at around 1:35.


But what about this A minor arpeggio played over the D7? (starts at 1:38)
And the descending run on the very last couple of measures before he passes it to Gonzalo reminds me of the one he does in this video at the very start

Might sound like just few "wrong" notes thrown in to somebody but it feels and surely is very well thought and Id love to understand the logic behind it.

Tim

Al Watsky

A- over D 7 is one of the most standard superimpositions. Its one of the first most people learn, often its the entire scale thats superimposed. So on the D7 you can think in terms of the A melodic minor. The idea is you get the extensions of the dominant chord while making a seemingly linear statement using the scale.
If some one is superimposing a chord shape that isn't a perfect fit there will be notes that "rub" those are the players choice and can happen by intention or accident.
So much of this kind of playing is the stuff of knack and habit that patterns will just come out if they have been practiced thousands of times.
If the player likes the effect they will repeat it.
Players will tend to come up with their own patterns and in many cases its really about the rhythm carrying the pattern forward to the resolution.
These players rely on their fluidity to overcome the illogic of some of their superimpositions.
A player who does not have sufficient control can try to copy this sort of thing but because they do not have sufficient technique to place the superimposition well will sound , shall we say awkward .
Theres one guy that takes a pattern and moves it up in various intervals till he gets the whole pattern 1 octave higher. On the way to the octave transposition he lays into the dissonant superimpositions hard and generates enormous tension. He does this while playing rather loudly. So its quite a volcanic effect.
You can take note groups "cells" and transpose them at fixed interval sets and get all sorts of interesting effects.
These are effects.