Right hand technique matter

Steve Elliott

If a violinist does not place significant effort on right hand technique, nobody will want to listen to him. To a certain extent it’s the same in GJ. I don’t think staring at someone’s right hand will help, but learning the technique will improve your sound.

NylonDave

There are some fundamental misunderstandings being perpetuated here.

Firstly about the way we see. Cognition is lead by expectation thus when we look at people play we see

1. What we want to see
2. What we can see
3. What we already know

The post below is a classic example of how self deceiving we can be when we are stuck at step 1.

Also the idea that knowing the truth of this somehow means that someone is not working on technique. This is entirely without substance, I can however see the appeal.

I think it is brave of Darius to point out what I have also being trying to point out and what the Evelyn Glennie video is all about.

And brave is a strange word because why should it take bravery to help people freely from a position of superior knowledge on a forum dedicated to one's area of expertise ?

Why did jon think there was anything acceptable about the post below ? it strikes me as the most transparently mean spirited attempt I have ever seen to gas light someone on a public forum. Beyond childish towards something else.

jonpowl wrote: »

Here is a link to watch Luca Pino's excellent GJ right hand technique:

(mods, I've emailed myself this to preserve the exact wording and tone)

Shemi

"And brave is a strange word because why should it take bravery to help people freely from a position of superior knowledge on a forum dedicated to one's area of expertise ?"

Do you claim the position of superior knowledge for yourself? Your posts give that impression as you seem to think you can talk down to most of us here.

Jim Kaznosky

You are all crazy.

NylonDave

I've saved this

Shemi wrote: »

"And brave is a strange word because why should it take bravery to help people freely from a position of superior knowledge on a forum dedicated to one's area of expertise ?"

Do you claim the position of superior knowledge for yourself? Your posts give that impression as you seem to think you can talk down to most of us here.

Sorry if I give that impression Shemi. Giving advice online is like trying to reach back in time and slap yourself on the face.

Another way of putting it is that we tend to treat others the way we treat ourselves, if we are honest.

I am pretty passionate about RH technique as a matter of fact, I had ten years of constant pain when I switched from pick to fingerstyle. Youtube is great for a lot of things but I really don't like the way the discussion about technique is going, because it is going nowhere.

Do I consider myself to be as capable as Darius of being effective playing jazz with others ? Absolutely not... I lack the expertise, I don't feel that I am alone here in that. But I don't know all of you and you only really know people when you play with them in the real world, one on one is good. Chances are lots of people here would send me home to the shed in shame, hopefully inspired too.

I do know hogwash though, I have swallowed enough and it took a long time to throw it up, most of it is old hat. But there is a new style of hogwash that offends me, I am not sure if you feel yourself an advocate for it but even if you do I certainly do not mean to talk down to you personally.

Any way Jim's mostly right, we are all crazy. Passion is GOOD though, as is debate. The clique and the dog whistle though.... not so much. We have a new member keen to share, lets make him welcome.

D.

Jim Kaznosky

If you have the time to post tomes on practice, then you have the time to practice. Do what you think is better for you.

I just think much of this is pointless and everyone is trying to get over on everyone else. Kind of a time waster and not really helpful to anyone.

Bones

For those of us who are not naturally gifted musicians practicing "proper" technique can be very helpful along with all the other stuff. It's all good.

Jim Kaznosky

Agreed. I practice technique every single day before I do anything else with the guitar. The time waster (for me) is making generalizations on what is the best way to learn. It's going to be different for everyone based on their learning style, level, enthusiasm (to correct issues), and available time.

I could have just avoided this thread altogether, so I suppose I'm as guilty as anyone else.

Carry on.

Shemi

@NylonDave Fair enough, I can understand that and I do enjoy your passion. I don't really see myself as an advocate of anything much, I love how the journey varies for everyone and feel that if it didn't we would all just end up sounding the same. Incidentally, that is what I love about teaching as it keeps you on your toes if you have the attitude of striving for the best learning experience for the student, and why I find teachers who rely solely on getting people through their grades frustrating.

I guess I'm just always a bit wary of absolutism. Anyways, I'm but a fledgling at this genre even though I have been a musician for most of my life. Taking this path is the best thing I've ever done to feed my soul musically.

Maybe I'm just being sensitive. I'm not very competitive, and in fact struggle with confidence. I've made real efforts this year to push myself out of my comfort zone, went to my first festival where I had my first jam experience, posted more videos of me playing on Facebook, did some workshops, etc. I hate cliques and all that stuff, which is pretty much the reason I never joined a professional orchestra like I was meant to and why my confidence got hammered when studying. It's funny but I've done massively high profile gigs on my cello and I very rarely get very nervous, but jamming with people in a pub or playing a solo in front of Denis in a workshop and I'm a nervous wreck!lol

Anyway, if anyone is looking for someone to derail a thread and go off on a tangent I'm your guy! (Sorry about that)

jeffmatz

I don't think a lot of what people are describing is obsessing...I'll maintain obsessing is bad. I know guys who are convinced they can't play because they can't get something EXACTLY like someone else does. That's obsessing.

What I see a lot of here is simply an attention to detail. Which is fine. Nobody seems paralyzed by it...

Seriously, if you want to see obsessing, visit jazzguitar.be and check out threads on Benson picking. I'm getting a headache just thinking about it.

Gypsy jazz is actually an easy one to let go of the obsessing from, because there really is a technique...sure, players are all a little different, but there's some basic fundamental stuff alost all the greats share...but rather than get hung up on say, perfect wrist angles, better to compare that bunch great players and look for the commonalities, not the idiosyncrasies.