Fast Chromatic Runs

BrettN

Thanks Jim, I had seen that video- crazy how well he plays that! I did notice only then that he plays the e string glissando with his second finger, not with his 3rd beginning on the g note. It looks to me like he’s alternating picking until he hits the C# to begin the chromatic run?

Buco

Here's is what I got. I just read your comment how he starts a glissando on the second finger. And I heard somebody say that before, that it's smoother that way. I did it starting with G note, ring finger, but I don't use this technique enough to notice the difference in efficiency. Hope it helps some:

https://youtu.be/7HLH4Pkpkpw

PS @Bones here's the example of "bedroom volume"

BrettN

Hey Buco, man thankyou so much for that! I really appreciate you taking the time to do that for me. I hope I can one day repay the favour!

I’m pretty much at the same speed as what you did it, maybe a little quicker but I’ve been working on it for a lot longer than a day like you had!

I guess it’s just over and over until we can get it faster? He (Stochelo) plays that sooooo well.

I love the waltz’s so much- it’s a bummer it’s gonna take me forever to master this one!!

Thanks again

Kudos Buco

MichaelHorowitz

I actually play Choti quite a lot and that run is definitely tricky. I pick it 100% following the Gypsy Picking rules so you get a lot of down stokes on the string changes (esepcially hard at tempo as you get "double downs" on the odd note groupings.) The key for me is to actually play certain parts of the phase a little bit rushed (the sections with three notes per string) which gives you a tiny bit more time to make the string changes. But be careful not to rush the entire thing and loose the beat.

I also do the chromatic run on the top E string with the 2nd finger which is usually the best way to do those (the thumb free of the neck.)

Buco

No worries, it's a win/win. I got a little practice out of it. When I was a new voice on the forum I sometimes wondered during discussions regarding similar things, why nobody makes a video, it would be easier then having a discussion about it. This video probably took less time then me writing a reply. And I learned something new.

I could actually play that part it at 75% tempo but that wasn't the point of the video. But that's why I suggested that as a reasonable goal. When it comes to practicing things like this, my thinking is practice at half tempo until you're solid with notes and picking and timing and such. Then instead of making incremental progress, go to your goal tempo immediately. Practice in small groups of notes, even 2-3 at a time but whatever feels comfortable. Then put them together. Practice each grouping for 2 minutes. That's how I practice a lot. But yeah whatever method you're using, you just keep plowing until you get better. There's solo that Olli Soikkeli likes to do ofter over Made for Wesley, kinda like one A section. I saw him demonstrating it and decided I'm gonna try to get this under my fingers. Took about 3 years before I could play it at his tempo (140bpm) with decent overall quality. Of course it was on and off over that period but I did spend a lot of time on it. I practiced as described above. Except when I just started I had to go even slower than 50%. Then I saw the guy play it at 160bpm but this time I said forget it.

It's really cool to see Stochelo play stuff like that so effortlessly, his right hand wrist looks like it's make out of rubber.

V-dub

I worked on this exact thing a few months back and threw in the towel. Just couldn't get it to speed.

But I did ask Duved about it in a lesson (he plays a wonderful version of this song too) and he said that he thinks more of these runs in terms of where you start and where you end. The end note being a landing pad of sorts. As long as you land on the last note in time, then the ones in between are less important.

Another tip I got from the great tenor banjoist Tyler Jackson for playing fast stuff is to, obviously work with a metronome and start slow. But he specifically stressed bumping up bpm 1-2 bpm per day AT THE MOST and resisting the urge to jump up 10bpm at a time and get discouraged. Gradual increases give your brain more time to internalize and rewire. Technically, I'm sure you've played stuff faster than this, it's really all in the brain and how it can put up blocks for your unhindered muscular movement.

BrettN

Thanks guys- everyone has contributed valid points and tips- I’m just stoked I found this forum and that people are happy to help with this stuff- it seems to correlate all my experiences with GJ in general so far. I’m just gonna stick at it and try everything that everyone has suggested and see what works.

V-dub: I’d love to hear Duved play this- or any of the waltzes for that matter! I love that guys rhythm and sound!

I think the lesson here is to realize that the guys who are nailing this lick have been at it longer!

No 6minutes Abs - again!!!😆

Thanks everyone

dennis

If you want to play that run the way stochelo plays it on the recording, it’s not the same as the one in the video rehearsal that was shared. I was actually in that room as they were rehearsing it for fun. stochelo hadn’t played it for a while and was experimenting. He even plays wrong chords and laughs about it towards the end (playing an E chord when it was supposed to be A).

Anyway on the recording, he’s playing a pure chromatic scale in a quantized way in 16th notes. Starting from C# all the way up two C# two octaves higher. You can also hear that he ends on an upstroke (no accent) because of the way things work out.

The other option is to do as others have suggested and have a starting note and ending note. So in the Stochelo rehearsal video he’s actually playing a fake chromatic scale (first 3 frets of each string) and then hoping for the best. Usually these unmetered chromatic scales are meant to be effects and you don’t have to play them so clean, you just have to land on the correct note at the correct moment.

Even then, if you played the perfectly quantized version it’s not always easy to be 100% clean, even Stochelo stumbles towards the end. The effect is what matters most

BrettN

Hey Dennis- wow! Thanks for chiming in. I love the humor in that clip re Nousche’s timing coming back in on the A chord! It’s gold!

I just had another look at the clip at quarter speed and yes, you’re right! No 4th fret notes ascending on the D, G and B strings. Upon watching this again it looks like he’s playing more chromatically descending than I first thought too?

For the record- I’m now thinking it’s D,E,F,G,F,E,D,C,B,C,D,E,F,G,F,E,D,C,B,A,G#,G,F,E,D#,D,C# then ascending as Dennis said. Is that what you guys make it as?

BrettN

just to clarify, previously I wasn’t playing a G# or a D# when descending- but maybe these 2 notes are added in the Stochelo video in place of the F# and D# when ascending to maintain the feel? Am I confused?🤣